Trading Discussion

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  • Let's smash the tennis trading in here shall we?

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    @Paul-McCay I'll check it out, I have always loved watching tennis. Took a bit of a break from it since the girls and automating my trading would love the get back into watching it.

  • To discuss all things cricket and golf

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    NZ ENG W
    ENG LAY 1.05
    Will take stake out 1.10 and green toward end of INNS if goes well
    ...
    Nice little easter fill up
    Letting some ride incase ENG balls it up
    It is something to chase to be fair

  • A Place for members to discuss potential ideas and profitable filters or ask for feedback on their ideas

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    Hey guys

    On a betangel free trial so dabbling with automation. Does anyone have the Johns 4+ horse dobbing bot? Was using this on fairbot with some success

    Cheers

  • Our daily pro picks

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    No selections today

  • We'll replicate our blog posts here and give you a heads up when we do new podcasts!

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    A few years ago I wrote a Betfair Trading bankroll managment guide for traders of all types. It is still a great article and worth reading for all traders you can [FIND IT HERE](https://betfairtradingcommunity.com/en/blog/betfair-trading-bankroll-staking-strategy-how-much-do-you-need).

    However, as lots of our Football Trading and Horse Racing traders are now using set and forget strategies, I realise we also need a guide for that type of betting bankroll.

    Set and forget strategies are essentially just betting on an outcome and letting the bet run. 

    This style of Betfair trading has become more popular in recent years, the idea of sitting at a PC all day trading is not only too time consuming but also not neccessary to make money on Betfair. 

    So, hey, why not save time and effort and use straight bets to make money? I mean if it makes money who cares what type of betting it is?

    Anyway, if you are at all interesting in set and forget betting on Betfair then you need to read this guide!

     

    What is the ideal bankroll for becoming a Betfair Trading pro-trader?

    We get asked this question all the time! However, the answer is different for set and forget betting...

    The key thing you have to be aware of when placing bets with no intention of trading out is that you will lose 100% of the stake you use. 

    This is obvious but the reason I mention this is that you will have more variance than the typical trading strategy, in some cases a lot more. 

    It's simple maths really, if you lose 100% of your stake when you lose a bet your losing runs will be more impactful. 

    So the way to combat this problem is proper bankroll management! 

    Every time we bet we are risking that stake, so let's think about each bet as a BIG BET.

    Our bankroll needs to have a certain amount of BIG BETS to cover a losing run.

    Not only that we don't want one bad day to cripple our bankroll, so we need enough to be extra safe.

    How many BIG BETS would you want?

    Well in trading you can get away with 50 (2% of your bankroll 2x50=100%) because you will not lose the full stake, you will be cashing out for a profit or a loss at some point.

    However, when straight betting 50 is not enough. Imagine you have a losing streak of 10 bets, this can easily happen when betting at odds against even when betting at evens.

    Suddenly you have lost 20% of your bankroll and that could be in one day. 

    That's not a sensible staking plan.

    So how many BIG BETS do we need.

    Well it depends on the odds you are backing at. Let me explain.

    If you are generally betting at odds on maybe 1.5 or below you could probably get away with 100 big bets.

    1% of your bankroll per bet should be fine because you will win at least 66% of the time on average. 

    If you are betting at evens to 3.0 you could probably get away with 200 big bets. (0.5% of your bankroll)

    This is actually the kind of bankroll professional poker players use, they will have 200-250 buy ins behind them (so when you see a player lose their buy in on TV, it's not the big deal the broadcasters will try and tell you!).

    If you are betting at odds above 3.0 it can get tricky, you will want more big bets the higher the odds go! Maybe 500+!

     

    So Let's Talk Money! 

    All this talk of percentages is great and definitely where you should start thinking from, rather than financial amounts but I know most of you will be asking, how much money do I need to bet on Betfair?

    Firstly, if you are new to trading you should start low, go as low as possible £1 bets so you need enough money to have as many £1 big bets as you need. £100 for 100 big bets, £250 for 250 big bets and so on. 

    Then you can raise stakes as you earn money according to your percentages, so you use the same percentage per bet but increase the stake naturally as your bankroll grows. 

    So if I doubled my bankroll from £100 to £200, I would now use £2 stakes and still have 100 big bets.

    If you want to know what bankroll I recommend for pro traders it is still the same as the previous article.

    If you are placing multiple bets per day on a variety of profitable strategies £5,000-£10,000 will be a great starting point, you can easily go semi-pro at that level, however, because of the low stake percentages you are probably going to want to get that up to £20,000+ eventually.

    Although, as I always state there is no rush! 

    Remember set and forget is so easy, you just place your bets and get on with your day, so there is less pressure to make big money because you are not wasting any time where you could be doing other things.

     

    What if it goes wrong?

    My simple rule that I have been told by so many traders over the years was godsend is this:

    If I lose half my bankroll I halve my stakes. (Obviously if you are using £1 minimum this can't be done but it's not a major worry at that level, you just may need to look at a different portfolio of strategies).

    By halving our stakes we give ourselves another chance to have success and it's nearly impossible to 'bust out' and lose our whole bankroll. 

    If I am using a £5,000 bankroll and £50 stakes then if it gets to £2,500 I will reduce stakes to £25 and so on. 

    This gives you maximum bankroll protecting and you will never be the victim of a horror 'I LOST MY BANKROLL IN ONE DAY' story!

     

    One final bit of advice...

    Please test your strategies before putting money on them, don't just backtest but forward test them as you go.

    Give it 6-12 months and really get a feel for what works and what doesn't before putting serious money down! 

    The biggest mistake Betfair traders make is to bet heavily on a strategy they have not fully tested, which usually leads to disaster.

    If you have any more questions about this please do not hesitate to ask me on the forum or contact my via email [email protected]

    Be safe with your bankroll, it will become your best friend in hard times!

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

  • Files, spreadsheets and everything else you need to get trading

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    @Greg-Mitchell That's great Greg. Have got everything except the tipster bit right. Will try that. Thank you so much for getting back to me so quickly.

  • 90 Topics
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    @alexander-hughes Ah ok, makes sense.

    That was the only thing that jumped out at me when I saw the question 🙂

  • 0 Votes
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    @conor-medlyn Hey buddy,

    I will speak with Martin about this one as it's my strategy but I didn't track it on those sheets, Martin did.

    I have been running it since the start all those years ago 16/17 now, which is scary. It's always been profitable year on year for me hence why I still use it.

    It is a riskier long term strategy as the losses hurt more because of laying.

  • Six nations

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    Might lay France to win the world cup after that performance today. Odds of about 4 atm.

  • Pinnacle Sportsbook

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  • my trading strategy.

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    @lee-woodman ok thanks alot mate appreciate it

  • Bitcoin Betting Exchange

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    Yep I sold all my crypto lol scares me as well well to volatile for my liking lol

  • Automation - Trading Bots Index

    Locked
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    I've added a general automation thread to this index 🙂

  • Betfair T&C changes.

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    @richard-lillis-0 said in Betfair T&C changes.:

    @john-folan I am raising again with all this information - will keep you updated.

    I get the feeling there is something else they are annoyed with that they have not told you, I hope you manage to ge tit overturned

  • PDC World Darts Championship Outrights

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    @chris-osborne Ahahahaha me and my grammar and spelling

  • This topic is deleted!

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  • Should I Stop or Should I Go?

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    @greg-mitchell Can I watch them do that? 😉

  • Thank you

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    @zac-harpa thanks so much for this message! I'm so glad you are enjoying it, it is great to have you here!

    What a great night you will have tonight, what a match that will be to go to.

  • Trading as a Business?

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    @mrs-h-m-price I declared earnings a few times when needed, for mortgages.

    I think benefits have a cut off if you have 16k in savings (may have changed) or your partner works. Not something I have looked into but may be worth looking up the official criteria.

  • U3.5 Exit

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    @james-menhenitt

    Hi James, you make some very interesting points. However im a bit of a thicko, so stats just keeps making me zzzzzzzzz.....see, it happened again! For me, if theres no clear favourite, i'll back U3.5....or if there's money in it, U4.5.....or U5.5. My qualifying factor is 'can i make a quid out of this' and i'll throw a fiver at it.

    I'd love to work out a sheet on my results but the passengers on my bus keep me busy for 11 hours a day. By the time i get to enter 2 games onto an excel sheet, I've already traded 10 games . I get more wins than losses and im hoping that over time that translates to a growing bankroll.

    Btw i'm hoping to cure that stat problem with a 14 week holiday staring next week....either it's going to show me that i'm the trading genius i've dreamed of being or it'll be a cure for my insomnia. Win / win from where i'm sitting 😎

  • Just had a crazy idea!

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    @andrew-gordon totally get you Andrew. However, these are games that id never bet against, especially Liverpool vs Bournemouth... an obvious mismatch .

  • Running to standstill?

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    @julian-drake-clarke said in Running to standstill?:

    @dan-mackinnon

    If I had blown my bank it wouldn't have been so bad. I would easily been able to find what's wrong and corrected it. However, I must be doing something right and can't find precisely what it is 🐻

    Losing money isn't the only this that shows us what's wrong, check the prices - would waiting to get involved give a better price? Etc... everything I spoke about in the Step 3 video.

  • Private Coaching?

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    @martin Seems im unable to add a thread to the Private Coaching section. Am i missing something?

  • This topic is deleted!

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  • Wuhan baby!!

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    @martin You little beauty! Kerching!:party_popper:

  • Recommended Websites

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    Thanks gents

  • New season

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    @andrew-macdonald I cannot wait for it to be back!!!